Karts at Hill Climbs and Sprints

[Maverick73]

Originally Posted by blackx

Sorry but I beg to differ on that one.....



More than likely the gap is where the drivers feet will end up.....

I hear what your saying and i don't disagree that it could happen but there would be a similar if not worse outcome if a bike rider was unfortunate enough to be spat off and slide towards the armco,
i still fail to see how a bike rider is less at risk than a kart driver.

[Hasta]

Originally Posted by Maverick73

I hear what your saying and i don't disagree that it could happen but there would be a similar if not worse outcome if a bike rider was unfortunate enough to be spat off and slide towards the armco,
i still fail to see how a bike rider is less at risk than a kart driver.

You answered your own question. The rider is normally spat off and only has his own mass and inertia to cope with . he doesnt have the mass of the kart pressing him into the barrier . I also think the bike does tend to go on ahead ( to clear the way )


Hasta

[AllanMcD]

My bikes somtimes went first and somtimes I want first then got whacked by the bike
I think I will stick to a car with a cage
Allan

[oldman]

Karl Scholar seems to go well at Shellsley in his monster !

[blackx]

Originally Posted by oldman

Karl Scholar seems to go well at Shellsley in his monster !

That's when he isn't piling it into the bank before Kennels...
The bank just after Crossing....
The sleepers/Recticel at Bottom S
The bank between Bottom and Top S...

Yep....He seems to go alright

[Lolat492]

Does he wear a belt?
I presume he walked away each time, but all a bit chancey.

[chavectra]

He does, and a full roll structure.

It's an incredible piece of kit imho, a micro car not a kart anymore,developed and built my an amazingly talented and very modest home engineer. His resourcefulness is fascinating. I love cathcing up with him whenever I'm at at SW. The chats are great and his enthusiasm for the 'Kar' and the sport is inspiring.

And he does 29's !! Great stuff

the Spectre is well worth a look - clever stuff on a minimal budget

as you can tell - I love it

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by oldman

Karl Scholar seems to go well at Shellsley in his monster !

Firstly the Spectre started life as a "kart-like" racing car. Secondly when the minimum wheelbase regs were imposed Karl switched to the four rear wheel design so as to lengthen the already oversized Spectre. Finally it is Shelsley and the Spectre is a unique take on the special and as such it perfectly at home at the venue.

[Jim Lamb]

Having seen Karts on the CI Hill Climbs I can see the appeal of them. I find them very exciting and fun to watch and they always seem to Invite more oohs and aahs from the crowds than most of the other machinery.

However, then I put my other head on and and start working through the what ifs. Those that know, will understand more fully my thought process when I say 'mechanism of Injury' and 'survivability' factors.

Karts by design have no suspension other than what is offered by the Tyres and as a result are more prone to track surface undulation, holes and trackside obstacles and when they encounter one of these, they do two things, stop abruptly or they tend to fly due to the flat plate undertray performing as a wing.

Now Saloon Cars, Single seaters and Motorcyles do the same, but these have suspension and therefore have a greater capability to deal with the 'un-smooth' bits and are therefore less prone to risky excursions.

Cars and Single seaters also have additional driver protection, in the form of Protection cells, Roll bars and Seat Belts, all designed to stop the occupant suffering blunt trauma or being ejected from the vehicle.

So where am I going with this?

Kart drivers and Motorcycles are at far greater risk of serious Injury or Death than mainstream Car occupants and that is what weighs heavily on the minds of the MSA and Organising Clubs. The weight gets even greater when Event Insurance is considered vs mitigation of risk with the need/cost of providing Improved Safety structures and finally lets not forget Health & Safety legislation ( I know we'd all like to!)

Yes the CI Events have a history of Kart entries and long may that continue, however once there is a Fatality or Serious Injury there will inevitably be a review and questions asked around what can be done to prevent it happening again.
This must also apply to Motorcycle entries on the Mainland and I do wonder how they are able to continue, other than there is an established history of entries.

The answer will be Improve the Safety of the Track, at ££££'s cost, to meet the MSA(Health & Safety) and Insurance underwriters requirements.
If the venue is Temporary or leased then there may be limitations on what can be done and the eventual decision is reached that it's not worth it. So no kart entrants. Most of the Permanent venues (Mainland Hillclimbs) would probably have prohibitive costs and Insurance requirements too.

I do think that many Sprint venues would be Ideal as many of them are Racing Ciruits and Licensed for Kart Racing, others are typically Airfields or have good run off areas with little solid Infrastrucure trackside, so I wonder, why no Kart category at Sprint events?
The cynic in me then kicks in and aligns with thoughts about giving the Top 12 guys a run for their money at less cost.

In stating all of the above I am mindful of two things:-
a) A persons right to Indulge in activities at risk to themselves, i.e. Dangerous Sports
and
b) Motorsport is Dangerous and those that participate do so knowing the risks.

Unfortunately the Law and society seem to step in at that point and say "thats fine, until it all goes messy then it must stop!" Bloody Killjoys

Long may the CI Kart entries continue, I think you will never crack the UK Mainland Hill Climbs, there's too many naysayers, I do think the Sprint Community could embrace the category though.

Stay safe,

Regards,

Jim

[RobertT]

Just to revive this thread, how about this one......long enough, 4 wheel suspension, fia approved roll structure, 6 point belts.....struggling to think why this would not be allowed in the 500cc racing class, oh and it only weighs 180kg

http://www.hyperracer.com/index.html