MSA launches Code of Conduct

[windy]

Originally Posted by St Eval

Moving gently back to MSA launches code of conduct. All of you licence holders watch what you put into print even on here. In January I receved a slapped wrist for a comment I made in the editorial of our club magazine. This was just asking a question nothing really inflamatory. Big brother reads your club magazines and maybe your forum.

Well they are not taking any notice of my comments, so it seems it doesn't matter what is posted on here, or indeed what is put in print and posted to them

Like I say we pay their wages and they are governing our sport on behalf of us. There's no harm in reminding them of this occasionally is there?

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by windy

Like I say we pay their wages and they are governing our sport on behalf of us. There's no harm in reminding them of this occasionally is there?

Absolutely correct Windy; the only trouble is that there are tens of thousands of "us" and the MSA governs the sport on behalf of everyone. They have to take the majority view no matter how distasteful that is to the minority. The other thing that has to be understood is that changes to Regulations etc do not happen overnight unless it is a blanket requirement on the grounds of safety or to obviate cheating.

By all means voice your concerns; get like minded people to also complain but do not be surprised when nothing happens as your views may be in the minority. It has been advised on previous threads what the correct action plan is if you wish to complain. I would advise following that. One final piece of advice is do not be confrontational or agressive in your dealings with the MSA as this will only succeed in helping your cause to fail.

[windy]

Hi Steve,

Never really had any issues with speaking directly to the MSA on the phone when you can get through They seem polite and happy to listen. Its emails and responding to them that's always been a problem for me.

The majority of license holders are rally people. The rules are pretty good for that discipline and generally kept up to date in line with the modern machinery as it appears on the scene. The rules are also simple to understand.

Hillclimbing is a differnet matter - the rules were written 30 years ago, haven't been updated since, they are too complicated, especially for outsiders & you get the distinct impression the MSA aren't really interested in changing them. Maybe its to do with the minority licence holder numbers compared to other disciplines?

[Brib]

Originally Posted by windy

Hi Steve,


The majority of license holders are rally people. The rules are pretty good for that discipline and generally kept up to date in line with the modern machinery as it appears on the scene. The rules are also simple to understand.

Hillclimbing is a differnet matter - the rules were written 30 years ago, haven't been updated since, they are too complicated, especially for outsiders & you get the distinct impression the MSA aren't really interested in changing them. Maybe its to do with the minority licence holder numbers compared to other disciplines?

I'm happy with the rules for hillclimbing, I don't think the rules are complicated, I was/still am, new to the discipline.

Are the rules for rallying more up to date and simple to understand? I don't know, but there still appears to be some dissatisfaction with them too. They don't cater for the substitution of other manufacturers engines in cars that didn't have them as originally produced. I'm sure I've heard that said.
Hillclimbing and sprinting do at the moment, lets not change that.

[windy]

Originally Posted by Brib

I'm happy with the rules for hillclimbing, I don't think the rules are complicated, I was/still am, new to the discipline.

Are the rules for rallying more up to date and simple to understand? I don't know, but there still appears to be some dissatisfaction with them too. They don't cater for the substitution of other manufacturers engines in cars that didn't have them as originally produced. I'm sure I've heard that said.
Hillclimbing and sprinting do at the moment, lets not change that.

Anything goes in rallying pretty much ref engines, as long as they are car derived or from the list of specialist manufacturers - e.g. Millington. For me the rules are 2wd, up to 2 litres, and being able to get the width of the tyre and wheel rim inside a 9" C shaped gauge. Safety equipment (cage, bash hat, overalls, in date harnesses and plumbed in fire extinguishers) and that's about it. It keeps things simple and the classes competitive.

The only dissatisfaction in rallying at the moment is concerning what RON fuel we can use and these stupid dry break fuel couplings.

Also the MSA don't like bike engines and space frames in rallying and won't issue log books to them anymore - it's sort of saying - MSA don't want sports libre I suppose

This car always makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck when I hear it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3lB-fcMYn8

[Brib]

Thanks I wondered what was allowed now.

Wow, Great car, should be compulsory. I wanted something like that in the '80's. To run in sprints and hillclimbs, but it didn't seem it would be allowed to be competitive. So I started to dream of race cars instead.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by windy

The majority of license holders are rally people. The rules are pretty good for that discipline and generally kept up to date in line with the modern machinery as it appears on the scene. The rules are also simple to understand.

Hillclimbing is a differnet matter - the rules were written 30 years ago, haven't been updated since ........

The whole Fuel Sampling controversy has arisen out of rallying probably because their rules were not stringent enough!

As for the Hillclimbing rules; those for Hillclimbing and Sprinting are regularly updated and are currently undergoing scrutiny. However rules cannot be changed overnight and have to reflect the majority requirement.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Brib

I wanted something like that in the '80's. To run in sprints and hillclimbs, but it didn't seem it would be allowed to be competitive. So I started to dream of race cars instead.

Yesterday at Castle Combe a certain Audi TT Replica did very well indeed and was extremely competitive!

[windy]

Originally Posted by Steve Wilkinson

The whole Fuel Sampling controversy has arisen out of rallying probably because their rules were not stringent enough!

As for the Hillclimbing rules; those for Hillclimbing and Sprinting are regularly updated and are currently undergoing scrutiny. However rules cannot be changed overnight and have to reflect the majority requirement.

Nothing to do with the rules not being stringent in rallying. Yet again it was the MSA ballsing things up. World Rally Cars (WRC's) have been allowed to run FIA approved fuel for many years, but then the MSA decided every car must run on 100 RON fuel from such a date - why? That meant essentially telling competitors you can't run your WRC any more, unless you spend a fortune changing the mechanical bits inside the engine. For the clubman competitor who's running an old spec WRC, the original engine manufacturer isn't going to be inclined to offer assistance developing an obsolete engine further to run on low octane fuel are they!

Because there were so many protests, and lots of fuss over the MSA's unsafe methods for fuel sampling, most clubs have now applied for exemption from running max 100 RON fuel on their events, and FIA fuel is still allowed. This essentially negates any further need for fuel sampling - but the MSA still want to twist the knife in the back of competitors by bringing the fuel sampling rule in and forcing people to spend money on a dry fuel break that will never be needed anyway. That's the reality of the situation - the MSA are making our sport more expensive by the day