Problem for Road Modified Classes

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by RussellT

OK things have become slightly clearer, having spent an hour with John Moxham rereading old Blue Books and having spoken to Chris seaman of BARC (Y) I can accept that not for the first time in my life I have been labouring under a misunderstanding.

The class of road modified has never been a Blue Book class but a local amendment to the Blue Book instigated and developed by BARC (Y) over the years and taken up by other local clubs. The allowable modifications are their rules not the MSA. I should have addressed my original question to Chris.

However it has brought to light the stark reality that the MSA missive that only MSA classes will be sanctioned from 2010 means that all road modified cars will have to either be returned to standard or progress to mod prod to be eligible for competition.

Looking at the LDMC events last year that represents over 40% of the entries. If a significant number of the present road modified classes decide not to bother this could signal a very bleak time for the clubs.

Russell, how many times do I have to say it ...........

The MSA do not sanction classes.

What you must do is go back to Chris Seaman and get him to lobby the Speed Events Committee on behalf of competitors in their championship. The objective must be to clarify the CATEGORY (not class!!!!) definitions within the MSA Blue Book. I will again repeat that I80 remains unchanged from when it was introduced and it is just the interpretation of one person that is causing all the troubles!

[Rescue Dude]

Really wish i hadn't moved house and lost my copy of Motorfarce now.

I intend to run in roadgoing next year with the modded but still, (as it stood as of 2008 )legal 205.

The suspension, though uprated has not been altered geometry wise in any way. If i could afford to be competitive in mod prod i'd be happy to do it but i can't so i'm happy where i am. Running in roadgoing.


Dear MSA, mind ya own business and let me stay there!!!!

[john m]

Steve - you are on the button !!
Classes are decided by the clubs not the MSA - but I do agree that some detailed definitions - like what is exactly meant by ''suspension configuration '' - are required urgently
We used to use the pick-up points rule or change of springs and s/abs only
As long as we know we are all reading the same rules we will be ok - and as long as scruters are strict but fair and consistent !! But don't get me started on that one !!

[RussellT]

Agreed Steve however the MSA do have to sign each event off and if they arnt happy with the club's class rules you wont get your event permit. Hopefully a sensible solution will be reached but what ever the outcome I certainly will be more proactive in asking what is allowed. If you dont understand the rules to which you are competing you are definitely at a disadvantage before you start.

[Steve Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by RussellT

Agreed Steve however the MSA do have to sign each event off and if they arnt happy with the club's class rules you wont get your event permit. Hopefully a sensible solution will be reached but what ever the outcome I certainly will be more proactive in asking what is allowed. If you dont understand the rules to which you are competing you are definitely at a disadvantage before you start.

It doesn't work that way; the MSA sign-off Championships which is done pre-season. Then it is a simple task for the MSA to check what championships are being run at each event. Once again the question of "Class Rules" does not impact on the MSA and should not cause an event license to be with-held. A club can run whatever classes it likes so long as they adhere to the MSA Category Standards.
I suspect that if a club runs a TOTALLY none championship meeting there may well be some problems for both them and the MSA.

[Radical]

It is common place for clubs to run non championship events, especially in these days of extra legislative rules causing former "test" days to be run is sanctioned events in order to bet covered under MSA insurance etc.

EACC ran a Charity sprint at Kames this year, definately non championship, not even club champ (BTDBTDBTD by Minitici driving my car )

[Derwent Motorsport]

The document circulated to championship organisers quoting the rules changes and the new "categories" (advised for 2009 and mandatory for 2010) was very confusing and I've yet to meet an organiser who understands them! I have asked that they are put on the agenda for the officials' training days this coming Jan/Feb.

[Derwent Motorsport]

The document sent out to organisers was really obscure, I've pondered over it for some hours and talked to other organisers. None of us can understand it. I've asked for it to be a topic at the Clerk's training days in January.

[RussellT]

Just to finish this one off. Having entered the Chester and Liverpool Speed Championship whose regs stipulate that "Competitors are asked to note that the classes fpr sprinting have changed for 2009 it is suggested that particular attention is made to eligibility of vehicles before entering." (Note the regs use bold face to emphasise this point)

The regs go on to refer the previous class 1b as road going series production saloon cars 1401cc up to 2000cc for which MSA regs I70 - I 81 apply (with no local amendments.)

I did as instructed and contacted the eligibility scrutineer Chris Mansley and gave him complete details of the modifications to my car which I believe to be fairly common place within the cars running in 1b last year and the reply was that I should enter class Modified Limited Production Saloon Cars 1401 - 2000cc.

So I shall do more Harewood events who are running the same classes as 2008.

[Rescue Dude]

Originally Posted by RussellT

Just to finish this one off. Having entered the Chester and Liverpool Speed Championship whose regs stipulate that "Competitors are asked to note that the classes fpr sprinting have changed for 2009 it is suggested that particular attention is made to eligibility of vehicles before entering." (Note the regs use bold face to emphasise this point)

The regs go on to refer the previous class 1b as road going series production saloon cars 1401cc up to 2000cc for which MSA regs I70 - I 81 apply (with no local amendments.)

I did as instructed and contacted the eligibility scrutineer Chris Mansley and gave him complete details of the modifications to my car which I believe to be fairly common place within the cars running in 1b last year and the reply was that I should enter class Modified Limited Production Saloon Cars 1401 - 2000cc.

So I shall do more Harewood events who are running the same classes as 2008.

Excuse my ignorance. You were in roadgoing but you've been advised to go into mod-prod?

Without giving away your secrets, why?